https://lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Talk:Sodium_Scenario&feed=atom&action=historyTalk:Sodium Scenario - Revision history2024-03-29T11:17:09ZRevision history for this page on the wikiMediaWiki 1.34.2https://lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Talk:Sodium_Scenario&diff=114710&oldid=prevFarred: Undo revision 114131 by 31.184.238.235 (talk) undo spam2016-08-22T13:06:35Z<p>Undo revision 114131 by <a href="/w/Special:Contributions/31.184.238.235" title="Special:Contributions/31.184.238.235">31.184.238.235</a> (<a href="/index.php?title=User_talk:31.184.238.235&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:31.184.238.235 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) undo spam</p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 13:06, 22 August 2016</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
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</table>Farredhttps://lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Talk:Sodium_Scenario&diff=114131&oldid=prev31.184.238.235: /* viagra viagra */ new section2015-12-16T23:15:36Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">viagra viagra: </span> new section</span></p>
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</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l27" >Line 27:</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
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</table>31.184.238.235https://lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Talk:Sodium_Scenario&diff=25660&oldid=prevFarred: Undo revision 25432 by 46.118.112.118 (talk) undo spam2014-07-04T21:28:53Z<p>Undo revision 25432 by <a href="/w/Special:Contributions/46.118.112.118" title="Special:Contributions/46.118.112.118">46.118.112.118</a> (<a href="/index.php?title=User_talk:46.118.112.118&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="User talk:46.118.112.118 (page does not exist)">talk</a>) undo spam</p>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
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</table>Farredhttps://lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Talk:Sodium_Scenario&diff=25432&oldid=prev46.118.112.118: /* qpslayAXnptwnyFHKoSWDqsJYBnVoMNgoCWGOwVbbBeNft */ new section2014-07-04T07:04:12Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">qpslayAXnptwnyFHKoSWDqsJYBnVoMNgoCWGOwVbbBeNft: </span> new section</span></p>
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</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l27" >Line 27:</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
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</table>46.118.112.118https://lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Talk:Sodium_Scenario&diff=9313&oldid=prevMdelaney at 04:02, 13 May 20072007-05-13T04:02:31Z<p></p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 04:02, 13 May 2007</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l19" >Line 19:</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::-- [[User:Mdelaney|Mdelaney]] 01:25, 13 May 2007 (UTC)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::-- [[User:Mdelaney|Mdelaney]] 01:25, 13 May 2007 (UTC)</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">::Just a fairly minor nitpick, technically 2 kHz qualifies as RF, but it's ULF band, very specialized and very narrow bandwidth. According to [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_frequency http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_frequency] it's listed for use in: Communication within mines. Not too sure if they mean mines(boom) or mines(coal) if you know what I mean. But if they mean the latter, we might need to keep that clear for our own mining ops.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">::2 kHz would definitely be subject to skin effect though so the point of using a better conductor in the skin is well taken. But might it not be just as effective to use a lower frequency and a slightly thicker iron cable? (We can probably get away with iron dust transformer cores at frequencies as low as 400 Hz).</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">::2 kHz 3 phase would produce a full-wave-rectified power-supply ripple frequency of 12 kHz, should be easy enough to filter out, but could be very irritating in the wrong place if a smoothing capacitor(condenser) goes open circuit (nowhere near as likely as a short circuit with electrolytics).</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">::-- [[User:Mdelaney|Mdelaney]] 04:02, 13 May 2007 (UTC)</ins></div></td></tr>
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</table>Mdelaneyhttps://lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Talk:Sodium_Scenario&diff=9312&oldid=prevMdelaney at 03:21, 13 May 20072007-05-13T03:21:04Z<p></p>
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<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #222; text-align: center;">Revision as of 03:21, 13 May 2007</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">The only problem I see is that sodium/potassium may not be suitable for buried wires, as described in the [[Sodium Scenario]], as they can be easily scooped with a spoon or cut with a knife. Even if the wire is re-enforced with fibers and an iron core, malleability of the conductive layer could prove to be an issue in high use areas. Excavations and geologic settling would need to be very closely monitored. Long term studies of this kind of buried wire combo may have very interesting results. Would Na and K slowly mix and produce NaK? Would there be enough heat or tension to meld them together? How would the wire deform under varying subterranean pressures? I also cannot help my curiosity about the rate of loss experienced by bare cable buried in lunar regolith, as it will be interesting to see what effects the nano-phase surface iron may have on an uninsulated circuit. How could all of the above effects be mitigated? Oh, what I would give for a bag of mare simulant and a couple of vacuum chambers in a real lab right about now.</del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">== Thinking Moon ==</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">[[User:Jarogers2001|Jarogers2001]] 17:22, 12 May 2007 (UTC)</del></div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">:I thought they got somewhat cold winters where you live</del>. <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Have you never seen condensation </del>on <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">windows and walls in winter? (Not usually prevalent in modern homes, </del>but <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">was quite </del>a <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">problem in older stone</del>, <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">brick and block buildings in much </del>of <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Europe)</del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">The Sodium entry is a good example of thinking Moon</ins>. <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline"> That is, looking at ideas that are insignificant when used </ins>on <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Earth </ins>but <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">could really save the day when used on the Moon. It does take </ins>a <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">rather long scenario to show how Sodium could be used</ins>, <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">but this is part </ins>of <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">the process needed to compare complicated technical ideas.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>:<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Luna's not very cold, but it's not very warm underground either, certainly not warm enough to eliminate the possibility of condensation. So I don't think sodium is suitable for indoors. Outdoors there's the problem of the daytime heat</del>, <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">more than enough to melt sodium.</del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">--[[User</ins>:<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Jriley|Jriley]] 13:25</ins>, <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">11 May 2007 (UTC)</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>:<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">If you'</del>re <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">going to go to the trouble of using </del>an iron core, <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">I don't think sodium offers enough </del>of <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">an advantage over just using iron on it's own. And remember, they only use </del>conductive <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">skins </del>to <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">mitigate skin effect, something that's not particularly bad over relatively short spans at </del>high <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">voltage </del>and <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">low frequency</del>. <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Basically your common HT </del>cable <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">on Earth is steel</del>, <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">they just put an aluminum skin on </del>it to <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">reduce losses</del>.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>:<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">The only problem I see is that sodium/potassium may not be suitable for buried wires, as described in the [[Sodium Scenario]], as they can be easily scooped with a spoon or cut with a knife. Even if the wire is </ins>re<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">-enforced with fibers and </ins>an iron core, <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">malleability </ins>of <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">the </ins>conductive <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">layer could prove </ins>to <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">be an issue in </ins>high <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">use areas. Excavations </ins>and <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">geologic settling would need to be very closely monitored</ins>. <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline"> Long term studies of this kind of buried wire combo may have very interesting results. Would Na and K slowly mix and produce NaK? Would there be enough heat or tension to meld them together? How would the wire deform under varying subterranean pressures? I also cannot help my curiosity about the rate of loss experienced by bare </ins>cable <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">buried in lunar regolith</ins>, <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">as </ins>it <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">will be interesting </ins>to <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">see what effects the nano-phase surface iron may have on an uninsulated circuit. How could all of the above effects be mitigated? Oh, what I would give for a bag of mare simulant and a couple of vacuum chambers in a real lab right about now</ins>.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>:<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline"><strike>Technically these two posts should be moved to </del>[[<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Talk</del>:<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Sodium_Scenario</del>]]<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">. If you move yours</del>, <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">I'll move mine. Using export - import isn't worth the headache for two posts. :</del>)<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline"></strike></del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>:[[<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">User</ins>:<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Jarogers2001|Jarogers2001</ins>]] <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">17:22</ins>, <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">12 May 2007 (UTC</ins>)</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>:-- [[User:Mdelaney|Mdelaney]] 01:25, 13 May 2007 (UTC)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">::I thought they got somewhat cold winters where you live. Have you never seen condensation on windows and walls in winter? (Not usually prevalent in modern homes, but was quite a problem in older stone, brick and block buildings in much of Europe)</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">::Luna's not very cold, but it's not very warm underground either, certainly not warm enough to eliminate the possibility of condensation. So I don't think sodium is suitable for indoors. Outdoors there's the problem of the daytime heat, more than enough to melt sodium.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">::If you're going to go to the trouble of using an iron core, I don't think sodium offers enough of an advantage over just using iron on it's own. And remember, they only use conductive skins to mitigate skin effect, something that's not particularly bad over relatively short spans at high voltage and low frequency. Basically your common HT cable on Earth is steel, they just put an aluminum skin on it to reduce losses.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">::<strike>Technically these two posts should be moved to [[Talk:Sodium_Scenario]]. If you move yours, I'll move mine. Using export - import isn't worth the headache for two posts. :)</strike></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color: #222; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">:</ins>:-- [[User:Mdelaney|Mdelaney]] 01:25, 13 May 2007 (UTC)</div></td></tr>
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</table>Mdelaneyhttps://lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Talk:Sodium_Scenario&diff=9310&oldid=prevMdelaney: Moved two posts fromTalk:Electrical_Conductors2007-05-13T03:15:27Z<p>Moved two posts fromTalk:Electrical_Conductors</p>
<p><b>New page</b></p><div>The only problem I see is that sodium/potassium may not be suitable for buried wires, as described in the [[Sodium Scenario]], as they can be easily scooped with a spoon or cut with a knife. Even if the wire is re-enforced with fibers and an iron core, malleability of the conductive layer could prove to be an issue in high use areas. Excavations and geologic settling would need to be very closely monitored. Long term studies of this kind of buried wire combo may have very interesting results. Would Na and K slowly mix and produce NaK? Would there be enough heat or tension to meld them together? How would the wire deform under varying subterranean pressures? I also cannot help my curiosity about the rate of loss experienced by bare cable buried in lunar regolith, as it will be interesting to see what effects the nano-phase surface iron may have on an uninsulated circuit. How could all of the above effects be mitigated? Oh, what I would give for a bag of mare simulant and a couple of vacuum chambers in a real lab right about now.<br />
<br />
[[User:Jarogers2001|Jarogers2001]] 17:22, 12 May 2007 (UTC)<br />
<br />
:I thought they got somewhat cold winters where you live. Have you never seen condensation on windows and walls in winter? (Not usually prevalent in modern homes, but was quite a problem in older stone, brick and block buildings in much of Europe)<br />
<br />
:Luna's not very cold, but it's not very warm underground either, certainly not warm enough to eliminate the possibility of condensation. So I don't think sodium is suitable for indoors. Outdoors there's the problem of the daytime heat, more than enough to melt sodium.<br />
<br />
:If you're going to go to the trouble of using an iron core, I don't think sodium offers enough of an advantage over just using iron on it's own. And remember, they only use conductive skins to mitigate skin effect, something that's not particularly bad over relatively short spans at high voltage and low frequency. Basically your common HT cable on Earth is steel, they just put an aluminum skin on it to reduce losses.<br />
<br />
:<strike>Technically these two posts should be moved to [[Talk:Sodium_Scenario]]. If you move yours, I'll move mine. Using export - import isn't worth the headache for two posts. :)</strike><br />
<br />
:-- [[User:Mdelaney|Mdelaney]] 01:25, 13 May 2007 (UTC)</div>Mdelaney