Difference between revisions of "Talk:Size of Infrastructure"
Jarogers2001 (talk | contribs) |
|||
| Line 6: | Line 6: | ||
*As far as I know there is no need for HLVs to start a lunar colony. The costs of maintaining launch facilities for HLVs are outsized just as the rockets are outsized. Since HLVs are infrequently launched, the annual maintenance costs are spread over few launches making HLVs expensive per pound of payload. Eliminating an entire unneeded class of launch vehicle results in savings that should not be missed.--[[User:Farred|Farred]] 14:24, 22 October 2008 (UTC) | *As far as I know there is no need for HLVs to start a lunar colony. The costs of maintaining launch facilities for HLVs are outsized just as the rockets are outsized. Since HLVs are infrequently launched, the annual maintenance costs are spread over few launches making HLVs expensive per pound of payload. Eliminating an entire unneeded class of launch vehicle results in savings that should not be missed.--[[User:Farred|Farred]] 14:24, 22 October 2008 (UTC) | ||
::Robert Bigelow has said that he plans to assemble mutiple Bigelow modules in LEO, then land them on the moon. For non-inflatable, rigid shell habitats, HLV's may be necessary. Using less costly, commercially available rockets is one of the advantages of the Bigelow approach. - [[User:Jarogers2001|Jarogers2001]] 15:16, 22 October 2008 (UTC) | ::Robert Bigelow has said that he plans to assemble mutiple Bigelow modules in LEO, then land them on the moon. For non-inflatable, rigid shell habitats, HLV's may be necessary. Using less costly, commercially available rockets is one of the advantages of the Bigelow approach. - [[User:Jarogers2001|Jarogers2001]] 15:16, 22 October 2008 (UTC) | ||
| + | |||
| + | :I see your point, Farred. However, the whole concept behind BDB (Big Dumb Boosters) like Sea Dragon is to reduce those costs throught simplicity. For example, how about using room temperature propellants such as H2O2 and kerosine/hydrocarbon instead of cryogenics like Lox/LH2? I do think, However, that below a certain point, sea launch becomes too costly, and it would probably be better to do a conventional land launch. We ship cargo in bulk on huge container ships, not one-by-one on rowboats. | ||
| + | |||
| + | We also need smaller launchers, I am not saying that we don't. It is a pity BDB was never applied to smaller launchers. [[User:T.Neo|T.Neo]] 22:35, 22 October 2008 (UTC) | ||
Revision as of 14:35, 22 October 2008
The assemblers need not be nano. Self-replicating factories will at first be very big. A good way to simplify the replication process is to have shared componentsmarsp.
As for HLVs, do not fixate on Ares V, constellation and NASA. One example is Sea Dragon. Sea Dragon had a payload capacity of 500 tons or so. HLVs have ~100, MLVs, say, ~20 tons. How hard would it be to scale down Sea Dragon to the size of an HLV or MLV?
If it is not vital to have a HLV for lunar return, it would certainly be preferred. Just not a NASA monstrosity. T.Neo 09:39, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
- As far as I know there is no need for HLVs to start a lunar colony. The costs of maintaining launch facilities for HLVs are outsized just as the rockets are outsized. Since HLVs are infrequently launched, the annual maintenance costs are spread over few launches making HLVs expensive per pound of payload. Eliminating an entire unneeded class of launch vehicle results in savings that should not be missed.--Farred 14:24, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
- Robert Bigelow has said that he plans to assemble mutiple Bigelow modules in LEO, then land them on the moon. For non-inflatable, rigid shell habitats, HLV's may be necessary. Using less costly, commercially available rockets is one of the advantages of the Bigelow approach. - Jarogers2001 15:16, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
- I see your point, Farred. However, the whole concept behind BDB (Big Dumb Boosters) like Sea Dragon is to reduce those costs throught simplicity. For example, how about using room temperature propellants such as H2O2 and kerosine/hydrocarbon instead of cryogenics like Lox/LH2? I do think, However, that below a certain point, sea launch becomes too costly, and it would probably be better to do a conventional land launch. We ship cargo in bulk on huge container ships, not one-by-one on rowboats.
We also need smaller launchers, I am not saying that we don't. It is a pity BDB was never applied to smaller launchers. T.Neo 22:35, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
